Parallel Talmud
Bava Batra — Daf 154a
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ראיה במאי רב הונא אמר ראיה בעדים רב חסדא ורבה בר רב הונא אמרי ראיה בקיום השטר
רב הונא אמר ראיה בעדים קא מיפלגי בפלוגתא דר' יעקב ורבי נתן
(סימן מניח) רבי מאיר כרבי נתן ורבנן כרבי יעקב
רב חסדא ורבה בר רב הונא אמרי ראיה בקיום השטר קא מיפלגי במודה בשטר שכתבו צריך לקיימו דר"מ סבר מודה בשטר שכתבו אינו צריך לקיימו ורבנן סברי מודה בשטר שכתבו צריך לקיימו
והא איפליגו בה חדא זימנא דתניא אין נאמנין לפוסלו דברי רבי מאיר וחכמים אומרים נאמנין
צריכא דאי איתמר ההיא בההיא קאמרי רבנן משום דאלימי עדים ומרעי שטרא אבל הכא הוא דלאו כל כמיניה אימא לא
ואי איתמר בהא בהא קאמר ר' מאיר אבל בהך אימא מודה להו לרבנן צריכא
וכן אמר רבה ראיה בעדים א"ל אביי מאי טעמא אי נימא מדכולהו כתיב בהו כד הוה מהלך על רגלוהי בשוקא ובהא לא כתיב בה שמע מינה שכיב מרע הוי אדרבה מדכולהו כתיב בהו כד קציר ורמי בערסיה והא לא כתיב בה שמע מינה בריא הוי
איכא למימר הכי ואיכא למימר הכי אוקי ממונא בחזקת מריה
ובפלוגתא דרבי יוחנן אמר ראיה בעדים ור' שמעון בן לקיש אמר ראיה בקיום השטר
איתיביה רבי יוחנן לרבי שמעון בן לקיש מעשה בבני ברק באחד שמכר בנכסי אביו ומת ובאו בני משפחה וערערו לומר קטן היה בשעת מיתה ובאו ושאלו את רבי עקיבא מהו לבודקו אמר להם אי אתם רשאים לנוולו ועוד סימנין עשויין להשתנות לאחר מיתה
In what [manner is] proof [produced]? — R, Huna said: Proof [is produced] by witnesses. R. Hisda and Rabbah, son of R. Huna, said: Proof [is produced] by the attestation of the deed. R. Huna said, 'Proof [is produced] by witnesses' [for he holds that] they differ on [the same] principles [as those] of R. Jacob and R. Nathan; (Mnemonic: MeNIaH) R. Meir [is of the same opinion] as R. Nathan and the Rabbis [are of the same opinion] as R. Jacob. R. Hisda and Rabbah, son of R. Huna, said, 'Proof [is produced] by the attestation of the deed,' [because] they differ [on the question whether, in the case] where a person admitted that he wrote a deed, [independent] attestation is required; for R. Meir is of the opinion [that] where one admitted that he wrote a deed, no [independent] attestation is required and the Rabbis are of the opinion [that], where one admitted that he wrote a deed, [independent] attestation [also] is required. But [did] they [not], however, once dispute on this [question]? For it was taught [in a Baraitha]: They are not believed [so far as] to invalidate it; these are the words of R. Meir. But the Sages say: They are believed! — [Both are] required. Because if [their] dispute] had been stated [in connection with] that [alone], [it might have been assumed that] in that [case only] did the Rabbis say [that attestation of the witnesses was necessary] because the witnesses are all-powerful and they themselves impair [the validity of] the document, but here, where all [the force of the document] does not depend on him, it might have been assumed [that he is] not [believed]. And if [their dispute] had been stated in [connection with] this [alone], [it might have been assumed that] in this [case only] did R. Meir say [that the donor is not believed], but in that [case] it might have been assumed [that] he agrees with the Rabbis. [Hence both were] required. Rabbah likewise stated [that the] proof is by witnesses. Abaye said unto him: What is the reason? If it be said 'Because in all [deeds] it is entered, "As he was [able] to walk about in the street", and in this [deed] no such entry is made, [therefore] it is to be concluded [that when the gift was made] he was a dying man', [it may be retorted], 'On the contrary! Since in all [deeds] it is entered, "As he was lying sick in his bed,", and [in] this [deed] no such entry is made, [therefore] it is to be concluded [that when he made the gift] he was in good health!' — As one inference is just as reasonable as the other, [replied Rabbah,] the money is to remain in the possession of its [original] owner. And [the following are] in the [same] dispute. For R. Johanan said: Proof [must be produced] by witnesses; and R. Simeon b. Lakish said: Proof [consists] in the attestation of the deed. R. Johanan pointed out [the following] objection against R. Simeon b. Lakish: It once happened at Bene-Berak that a person sold his father's estate, and died. The members of the family, thereupon, protested [that] he was a minor at the time of [his] death. They came [to] R. Akiba and asked whether the body might be examined. He replied to them: You are not permitted to dishonour him; and, furthermore, [the] signs [of maturity] usually undergo a change after death.