Parallel Talmud
Ketubot — Daf 31b
Babylonian Talmud (Gemara) · Soncino English Talmud
פטור אדתני היה מגרר ויוצא מגרר ויוצא פטור נפלוג וניתני בדידה במה דברי' אמורים בעומד לפוש אבל לכתף פטור
אלא הא מני בן עזאי היא דאמר מהלך כעומד דמי אבל זורק מאי פטור ניפלוג [וניתני] בדידה במה דברים אמורים במהלך אבל זורק פטור
מגרר ויוצא איצטריכא ליה ס"ד אמינא אין דרך הוצאה בכך קמ"ל
ובמאי אי ברברבי אורחיה הוא אי בזוטרי לאו אורחיה הוא אלא במיצעי
ודאפקיה להיכא אי דאפקיה לרה"ר איסור שבת איכא איסור גניבה ליכא אי דאפקיה לרשות היחיד איסור גניבה איכא איסור שבת ליכא לא צריכא דאפקיה לצידי רשות הרבים
וכמאן אי כר' אליעזר דאמר צידי רה"ר כרה"ר דמו איסור שבת איכא איסור גניבה ליכא אי כרבנן דאמרי צידי רה"ר לאו כרה"ר דמו איסור גניבה איכא איסור שבת ליכא
לעולם כר' אליעזר וכי אמר ר"א צידי רה"ר כרה"ר דמו הני מילי לענין חיובא דשבת דזימנין דדחקי רבים ועיילי להתם אבל לענין מיקנא קני מ"ט דהא לא שכיחי רבים
רב אשי אמר כגון שצירף ידו למטה משלשה וקיבלו כדרבא דאמר רבא ידו של אדם חשובה לו כארבעה על ארבעה רב אחא מתני הכי
רבינא מתני לעולם דאפקיה לרה"ר וברה"ר נמי קנה ותרוייהו בדיוקא דהא מתני' קמיפלגי דתנן היה מושכו ויוצא ומת ברשות בעלים פטור הגביהו או שהוציאו מרשות בעלים ומת חייב
רבינא דייק מרישא רב אחא דייק מסיפא רבינא דייק מרישא היה מושכו ויוצא ומת ברשות בעלים פטור טעמא דמת ברשות בעלים הא הוציאו מרשות בעלים ומת חייב רב אחא דייק מסיפא הגביהו או שהוציאו הוצאה דומיא דהגבהה מה הגבהה דאתי לרשותיה אף הוצאה נמי דאתי לרשותיה
לרב אחא קשיא רישא לרבינא קשיא סיפא רישא לרב אחא לא קשיא כמה דלא אתי לרשותיה רשות בעלים קרינא ביה סיפא לרבינא לא קשיא הוצאה דומיא דהגבהה לא אמרינן:
הבא על אחותו ועל אחות אביו כו': ורמינהו אלו הן הלוקין הבא על אחותו ועל אחות אביו ועל אחות אמו ועל אחות אשתו ועל אשת אחיו ועל אשת אחי אביו ועל הנדה
He would be free [from payment]? [If so] instead of teaching 'but if he dragged it along he is free [from payment]', let him make the distinction in the same case. 'When is this said? If he stood still to rest; but if [he stood still] to adjust the cord on his shoulder, he is free [from payment]'? But [answer thus:] Whose opinion is this? It is that of Ben 'Azzai, who says: Walking is like standing. [But] how would it be if he threw [the purse]? He would be free [from payment]. Let him then make the distinction in the same case, thus when is it said: 'When he walked, but when he threw it, he is free'? — The case of dragging it along is necessary [to be stated]. You might have said that this is not the way of carrying out, so he lets us hear [that it is not so]. Of what [kind of purse does it speak]? If of a large purse, this is the ordinary way [of carrying it out], and if of a small purse, this is not the ordinary way? — In fact [it speaks] of a middle-sized [purse]. But where did he carry it to? If he carried it into the public road, there is desecration of the Sabbath but no stealing, and if he carried it into private ground, there is stealing but no desecration of the Sabbath! — No, it is necessary [to state it] when he carried it out to the sides of the public road. According to whose view? If according to [that of] R. Eliezer, who says: The sides of the public road are like the public road, there is desecration of the Sabbath but no stealing and if it is according to the view of the Rabbis, who say: 'The sides of the public road are not like the public road,' there is stealing but no desecration of the Sabbath? — Indeed, it is according to R. Eliezer, and when R. Eliezer says: 'The sides of the public road are like the public road', it is only with regard to becoming guilty of the desecration of the Sabbath, because sometimes, through the pressure of the crowd, people go in there, but with regard to acquiring, one does acquire there, because the public is not often there. R. Ashi said: [We speak of a case] when he lowered his hand to less than three [handbreadths] and received it. [And this is] according to Raba, for Raba said: The hand of a person is regarded as [a place of] four by four [handbreadths]. R. Aha taught so. Rabina [however] taught: Indeed, when he carried it out into the public road, for he acquires also in the public ground. [And] they differ with regard to a deduction from this Mishnah, for we have learned: If he was pulling it out and it died in the domain of the owner, he is free; but if he lifted it up or brought it out from the territory of the owner and it died, he is bound [to pay]. Rabina makes a deduction from the first clause, and R. Aha makes a deduction from the second clause. Rabina makes a deduction from the first clause: 'If he was drawing it out and it died in the domain of the owner, he is free'. The reason [for his being free] is because it died in the domain of the owner, hut If he had brought it out from the domain of the owner and it died, he would have been hound [to pay]. R. Aha makes a deduction from the second clause: 'but if he lifted it up or brought it out [etc.]' Bringing out is like lifting up; as lifting up is [an act through which the object] comes into his possession, so bringing out [must he an act through which the object] comes into his possession. According to R. Aha the first clause is difficult and according to Rabina the second clause is difficult? — The first clause is not difficult according to R. Aha, for as long as it has not come into his possession it is called: 'in the domain of the owner'. The second clause is not difficult according to Rabina, for we do not say [that] bringing out is like lifting up. IF ONE HAD INTERCOURSE [BY FORCE] WITH HIS SISTER, OR WITH THE SISTER OF HIS FATHER, etc. There is a question of contradiction against this: The following persons receive [the punishment of] lashes: he who has intercourse with his sister, with the sister of his father, with the sister of his mother, with the sister of his wife, with the sister of his brother, with the wife of the brother of his father, or with a woman during menstruation,