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כתובות 14
Soncino English Talmud · Berean Standard Bible
'Yes. [it is] from me.' R. Joseph said: Why should we be afraid? First, he admits, and moreover, Rab Judah said [that] Samuel said: The halachah is according to Rabban Gamaliel. Abaye said to him: And in this [case]. if he did not admit, would Rabban Gamaliel declare her as fit? Did not Samuel say to Rab Judah: 'Sharp-witted one! The halachah is according to Rabban Gamaliel, but you should not act upon it, unless most men are fit for her,' whereas here most men are unfit for her! — And according to your reasoning is not this [statement] in itself difficult? [First he says] 'The halachah [is. etc.'] [and then] 'do not act in practice [on it]'! Hence you must say: The one ruling applies before the other after it was done, and in this case also it is like 'after it was done.' Abaye asked Raba: Did R. Joshua Say: She is not believed? This would be in contradiction with the following: R. Joshua and R. Judah b. Bathyra testified concerning the widow [of one who was] of a mixed family that she is fit to marry a priest! — He said to him: Now is this so? There the woman marries, and [in that case] she examines and [then] marries; but here the woman misconducts herself; does she first examine and then misconduct herself? Raba said: Is the contradiction [only] between [one statement of] R. Joshua and [the other Statement of] R. Joshua. [but] not between [one Statement of] Rabban Gamaliel and [another Statement of] Rabban Gamaliel? Surely the concluding clause teaches: Rabban Gamaliel said to them: We accept your testimony, but what can we do, since Rabban Johanan b. Zakkai decreed that no court be set up for this purpose. because the priests will obey you to remove but not to bring near? — But, said Raba; there is no contradiction between [the statement of] Rabban Gamaliel and [the other statement of] Rabban Gamaliel, [because] there it is sure' [and] here it is 'perhaps.' Neither is there a contradiction between [the one statement of] R. Joshua and [the other statement of] R. Joshua, [because] there there is one doubt [and] here there is a double doubt. Therefore, according to Rabban Gamaliel the 'sure' is [so] strong [a plea] that even where [there is only] one doubt he declares [her] fit, and the 'perhaps' is [so] weak [a plea] that even where there is a double doubt he declares [her] unfit. [And] according to R. Joshua one doubt is [so] strong that even in the case where [she pleads] 'sure' he declares [her] unfit, and a double doubt is [so] light that even in the case where [she pleads] 'perhaps' he declares [her] fit. Our Rabbis taught: Which is the widow [of one] of a mixed family? When there is with regard to it [no doubt] on account of mamzeruth, nathinuth and on account of slaves of the kings. R. Meir said:
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I have heard that when there is none of these [defects] in the family one permits [its members] to marry into the priesthood. R. Simeon b. Eleazar said in the name of R. Meir. and R. Simeon the son of Menasia also said it: Which is the widow [of one] of a mixed family? When a doubtful halal was mixed up in it, [for] the Israelites know the mamzerim who are among them, but they do not know the halalim who are among them. The Master said: 'Which is the widow [of one] of a mixed family? When there is with regard to it [no doubt] on account of mamzeruth, nathinuth and on account of slaves of the kings'. [This would show that if there is a doubt on account of] a halal [in the family] it is fit. Why should these be different? [Because] these are Biblical? A halal is also Biblical! And further: 'R. Meir said: I have heard that when there is none of these [defects] in the family one permits [its members] to marry into the priesthood'. This is the same [as that which] the first Tanna [taught]! And further: 'R. Simeon b. Eleazar said in the name of R. Meir, and R. Simeon b. Menasia also said it: Which is the widow [of one] of a mixed family? When a halal was mixed up in it, [for] the Israelites know the mamzerim who are among them, but they do not know the halalim who are among them.' Surely it says in the first clause [that if there is a doubt regarding] a halal [in the family, the family is] fit [to marry into the priesthood]! R. Johanan said: There is a difference between them [concerning a person who when he is called] mamzer protests and [when he is called] halal is silent. The first Tanna holds [that] every person who when called 'unfit' is silent is [considered] unfit, and thus the first Tanna said: Which is the widow [of one] of a mixed family? When there is in it no one who is silent if he is called mamzer or nathin, or slave of the king, or halal. Whereupon R. Meir said to him: This applies only to [each of] these cases since [he who calls him thus is liable to] render him unfit [to enter] into [the congregation,] but he who is called a halal and is silent, is fit, and the reason he is silent is that it does not trouble him. Whereupon R. Simeon b. Eleazar said to the first Tanna of R. Meir: If you have heard that R. Meir declares the person fit in the case of silence, this is not when he is called halal and is silent, but when he is called mamzer and is silent, for the reason he is silent is because he says to himself; 'a mamzer is well-known'. But [if he is called] mamzer and he protests. or [he is called] halal and is silent he is unfit, for the reason he is silent is because he thinks, 'it is enough if he is not excluded from the congregation'. One Baraitha taught: R. Jose says: [if he is called] mamzer and is silent, he is fit, and if he is called halal and is silent, he is unfit. And another Baraitha taught: [if he is called] halal and is silent he is fit, [but if he is called] mamzer and is silent, he is unfit. There is no difficulty; the one is according to the first Tanna in the sense of R. Meir, and the other one is according to R. Simeon b. Eleazar in the sense of R. Meir. MISHNAH. R. JOSE SAID: IT HAPPENED THAT A GIRL. WENT DOWN TO DRAW WATER FROM A SPRING AND SHE WAS RAVISHED. R. JOHANAN B. NURI SAID: IF MOST OF THE INHABITANTS OF THE TOWN MARRY [THEIR DAUGHTERS] INTO THE PRIESTHOOD, THIS [GIRL] MAY [ALSO] MARRY INTO THE PRIESTHOOD. GEMARA. Raba said to R. Nahman: According to whom did R. Johanan b. Nuri say [this n the Mishnah?]. If according to Rabban Gamaliel, [surely] he declares as fit even when there is a majority of unfit! [And] if it is according to R. Joshua, [surely] he declares as unfit even when there is a majority of fit! — He said to him: Rah Judah said [that] Rab said:
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