Chullin — Daf 89b

שיעורא בעינן ועבודת כוכבים כתותי מכתת שיעורא הכא כל מה דמכתת מעלי לכסוי:

הדרן עלך כסוי הדם

מתני׳ גיד הנשה נוהג בארץ ובחוצה לארץ בפני הבית ושלא בפני הבית בחולין ובמוקדשין ונוהג בבהמה ובחיה בירך של ימין ובירך של שמאל ואינו נוהג בעוף מפני שאין לו כף

ונוהג בשליל ר' יהודה אומר אינו נוהג בשליל וחלבו מותר

ואין הטבחין נאמנין על גיד הנשה דברי רבי מאיר וחכמים אומרים נאמנין עליו ועל החלב:

גמ׳ מוקדשין פשיטא משום דאקדשיה פקע ליה איסור גיד מיניה

וכי תימא יש בגידין בנותן טעם ואתי איסור מוקדשין וחייל אאיסור גיד האי מוקדשין נוהג בגיד מיבעי ליה אלא קסבר אין בגידין בנותן טעם ובמוקדשין איסור גיד איכא איסור מוקדשין ליכא

וסבר תנא דידן אין בגידין בנותן טעם והתנן ירך שנתבשל בה גיד הנשה אם יש בה בנותן טעם הרי זו אסורה

אלא הכא בולדות קדשים עסקינן וקסבר נוהג בשליל וקסבר ולדות קדשים במעי אמן הן קדושים דאיסור גיד ואיסור מוקדשין בהדי הדדי קאתי

ומי מצית מוקמת לה בשליל והא מדקתני סיפא נוהג בשליל מכלל דרישא לאו בשליל עסקינן הכי קאמר דבר זה מחלוקת דרבי יהודה ורבנן

ומי מצית אמרת דתרוייהו בהדי הדדי קאתו והתנן על אלו טומאות הנזיר מגלח על המת ועל כזית מן המת

וקשיא לן על כזית מן המת מגלח על כולו לא כל שכן ואמר רבי יוחנן לא נצרכה אלא לנפל שלא נקשרו אבריו בגידין

a minimum size is prescribed, and since it has been used for idolatry it is regarded as though the size were diminished,1 whereas here the more broken up it is the better it is for covering up. 2 MISHNAH. [THE PROHIBITION OF] THE SCIATIC NERVE3 IS IN FORCE BOTH WITHIN THE HOLY LAND AND OUTSIDE IT, BOTH DURING THE EXISTENCE OF THE TEMPLE AND AFTER IT, IN RESPECT OF BOTH UNCONSECRATED AND CONSECRATED [ANIMALS]. IT APPLIES TO CATTLE AND TO WILD ANIMALS, TO THE RIGHT AND LEFT HIP, BUT IT DOES NOT APPLY TO BIRDS BECAUSE THEY HAVE NO SPOON-SHAPED HIP.4 IT ALSO APPLIES TO A FOETUS. R. JUDAH SAYS, IT DOES NOT APPLY TO A FOETUS. AND ITS5 FAT IS PERMITTED. BUTCHERS ARE NOT TRUSTWORTHY WITH REGARD TO THE [REMOVAL OF THE] SCIATIC NERVE:6 SO R. MEIR. THE SAGES SAY, THEY ARE TRUSTWORTHY WITH REGARD TO IT AS WELL AS WITH REGARD TO THE [FORBIDDEN] FAT. GEMARA. IN RESPECT OF . . . CONSECRATED [ANIMALS]. But is not this obvious? Surely because one consecrated the animal the prohibition of the nerve has not thereby vanished!7 And if you were to say that [our Tanna] is of the opinion that nerves impart a taste [to the meat], and [he teaches us] that the prohibition of a consecrated animal can be superimposed upon the prohibition of the nerve,8 then the Tanna should have said: ‘The prohibition of [eating] consecrated meat applies to the nerve too’! — Rather we must say that he is of the opinion that nerves do not impart a taste, [and he thus teaches us9 that] in regard to [the sciatic nerve of] a consecrated [animal] there is only the prohibition of the nerve but not the prohibition of consecrated things.10 But does our Tanna hold that nerves do not impart a taste? Surely we have learnt: If a thigh was cooked together with the sciatic nerve it is forbidden if it imparts a taste11 [into the thigh]! — Rather we must suppose that he is dealing with the young of consecrated animals.12 And he is of the opinion that it [sc. the prohibition of the sciatic nerve] applies to a foetus, and also that the young of a consecrated animal is holy even when in its dam's womb; accordingly the prohibition of the nerve and the prohibition of consecrated things come into force simultaneously.13 But how can you suggest that the Mishnah is dealing with a foetus? Surely since in a subsequent clause it says. IT ALSO APPLIES TO A FOETUS, it is obvious that the first clause is not dealing with a foetus! — This is what he means: This14 is indeed a matter of dispute between R. Judah and the Rabbis. But how can you say that both [prohibitions] come into force simultaneously? Surely we have learnt:15 By reason of uncleanness contracted from the following sources the Nazirite must shave [his head]:16 a corpse, an olive's bulk of [the flesh of] a corpse etc. Now the question was asked: If he must shave [his head] on account of an olive's bulk of [the flesh of] a corpse, then surely he must shave [his head] for the whole corpse! And R. Johanan answered that it was necessary [to mention the corpse itself] only for the case of an abortion whose limbs were not yet knit together by nerves.17 destroyed is deemed destroyed forthwith. Raba's dictum. the entire hip is very much like the back of a spoon or like a club. This feature is expressly specified in the prohibition, lrhv ;f, the spoon of the thigh, i.e., ‘the convex prominence of the thigh’. Gen. ibid. consequently one may not rely upon him. sciatic nerve which is expressly prohibited whether it is edible or not, and secondly for eating ‘flesh’ (for nerves are edible as flesh) of a consecrated animal. that if there were more than sixty parts of permitted matter as against one part prohibited, the latter cannot impart a flavour unto the former. From this Mishnah, however, it is apparent that nerves do impart a taste; and as it is (infra 96b) in the same chapter as our Mishnah it was taught presumably by the same Tanna. At this same moment the prohibition of the sciatic nerve attaches to it. Nazirite unclean.